ABOUT THIS EPISODE
Every company has an operating system that determines how people solve problems, plan, prioritize, communicate, and measure success. Often, an operating system is inconsistent, though, leading to employee frustration and burnout.
Here's what we discussed:
- What The Entrepreneurial Operating System (EOS) actually is
- The six pieces of the EOS pizza pie
- The biggest hurdle organizations face in the EOS development process
Episode · 8 months ago
SHARE THIS EPISODE
Episode · 8 months ago
The Organizational Impact of EOS (Entrepreneurial Operating System] w/ Luke and Joel Wittenbraker
ABOUT THIS EPISODE
Every company has an operating system that determines how people solve problems, plan, prioritize, communicate, and measure success. Often, an operating system is inconsistent, though, leading to employee frustration and burnout.
Here's what we discussed:
- What The Entrepreneurial Operating System (EOS) actually is
- The six pieces of the EOS pizza pie
- The biggest hurdle organizations face in the EOS development process
It's really your business right in themiddle of this circle is made up of six components: Your Vision, the data, theprocess, the issues welcome to the manufacturing executivepodcast, where we explore the strategies and experiences that aredriving midsize manufacturers forward here. You'll discover new insights frompassionate manufacturing leaders who have compelling stories to share abouttheir successes and struggles and you'll learn from btob sales andmarketing experts about how to apply actionable business developmentstrategies inside your business. Let's get Ino the show welcome to another episode of theManufacturing Executive Podcast, I'm Joe Sullivan your host and a cofounderof the Industrial Marketing Agency Garilla. Seventy six every company hasan operating system, whether it has a name or not. That system is the way acompany organizes all of its human energy. It's the way that people in theorganization meet solve problems, plan, prioritize, follow processes,communicate, measure structure, clarify roles, lead and manage it's hard tounderstand the operating systems of most companies, because the leadershipteams aren't consistent and how they do the above. This inconsistency leads topoor communication dysfunction and employees feeling frustrated andconfused about what the priorities are. Ultimately, the company never realizesits full potential. These words, I just read- you are from the opening chapterof a book called what the Heck is eos by Gino Wickman and based on his otherbook, traction and the're, an introduction to his platform, theentrepreneurial operating system, which is known to most as Eos. Today. Myguests are a father and son duo from a manufacturing organization. That's beenrunning eos for a few years now, they're going to break down thecomponents of the system and talk about the impact Eos has had on theirorganization. So let me introduce a jol and Luke witten breaker from MaktuckJoe Witbreaker came to macktac, one thousand nine hundred and ninety four,with a finance and investment background, and as he'll tell you now,these are his words, not mine. By the way, Joel has managed to make everyoperational mistake possible sinse. Fortunately, it's a big market andworld and they never quit chasing opportunities. Effort, commitment andpassion have kept both Joel and his company mactach. Moving in the rightdirection, Joe loves the challenge of solving problems under pressure dealingwith sharp people and helping good things happen. Luke witn breaker is apassionate strategic entrepreneurial leader looking to become a trendsetterin the energy industry. Lupe join macteck in O thousnd and eleven ismarketing director and as far as Joel and Luke's company mactec goes, Makteckis a leader and development of onsight maching equipment and processesoffering standard product supply on a sale or rental basis, specialized tool,design and development, and full onsite staffed contract service to a varietyof industries such as oil and gas processing, industrial cutting, subsdecommissioning power generation, ship building and many more joe and Luke.Welcome to the show, thanks for having US thanks, Jo, you bet. I did my firstever sort of dual interviewe episode a few weeks ago, so you're the secondone's doing this, and I like the dynamic of an and we have a father sondynamic, going on here too sothat should be very interesting as well soexcited to get into this e go yeah H, we'll Sey, you guys can be the judge soguys. I know that both in my world of marketing and your world ofmanufacturing, els or the entrepreneurial operating system, whichis based on the book traction by Geno Wickman, is a fairly well knownplatform. Some listeners right now are probably already using it inside theirorganizations. Others may be somewhat familiar or maybe have heard of it, butI'm sure that some right now are also thinking themselves, wait, Yeo. What so?I was hoping that you could maybe just start by very quickly describing inyour own words. What is this Whole Entrepreneurial Operating System or Eosthing in the first place? Golook I mean the EO. What that you just said kind ofsort of hits the nail on the head for me, because you drop the word system,entrepreneurial operating system and I'm truly a believer that it is asystem to run a business off and our business has been going for forty yearsand we just started using eos three years ago. So plenty of people outthere can run a business without it and be successful and we were successfulwithout it. But it's helped us add a system and structure to our businessthat we never had before I'm sort of looking at the Eos Pizza Pi, as we callit e bat to do the little Italian thing that we've discussed a D and it'sreally your business right in the middle of this circle is made up of sixcomponents: Euter Vision, the data, the process, the issues you have and thepeople that make up your business and...
...all of this creates traction, which isthe last pizza Pi piece in that circle. Graphic which are you know you can diginto it in the book or within this conversation each of those slices, butthey all come together to create results within your business and it's asystem that just drives you forward every week, every month, every quarterevery year and just keeps growing, yeah good good over vugile. Anything youwante to add to that before. I I don't want to get. I want to get into thePizza Pie in a second here, but from Afrom my perspective, you know,enpreneurs and people that are driven in the business world are going to go,do their thing and they're going to go, try and create business, and but weforgot, we never took the time or whatever, to build structure and buildaccountability. I mean the biggest thing that I get that we have gotten tomy view on a US, as it creates a real, clear accountability and a real, clearcommunication path that everybody n. The organization knows what that means.I mean accountability. Everybody's got ordn, charts and stuff that tos you whoreports to who or whatever. But this tells you what you're responsible forthe organization- and you owe that to the rest of the people in yourorganivation and it defines rule sets an but all of which are flexible. Theseare all guidelines, O all withs, your flexible, and then it drives around acouple of fundamentals, which is you, as as a group need to define what yourcore values are, and those are the tenants that you live by in YourBusiness and you have to drive everything you do around those withinyour business, and so, if I could point anything I'd say it's the Corvius inthe accountability and then the rest of his nice structures and gooddisciplines and good record keeping kind of systems of scorekeeping andstuff. But those are the two things that I've seen the most dramatic impactfrom right. Well, let's break down the pizza pot, then so, there's you knowluke kind of hit very quickly, O on what the six components are. There'svision, data processes, issues, people and traction. You guys want to kind oftag team this one and ship away at what each of these are to make this moretangible concept to our listeners or sales and marketing manager. Theeasiest one for me to hit on first is data score cards. veasurables thingsthat many companies probably do, but don't take action on is what I wouldput it at truth, be told we're having a bad score card week this week and I'malready fretting about IDs ing it next week, which is another vos term.Identify discuss solve a problem, so our score card has metrics on it thatour leadership team views eve. Every week we have a meeting and we view ourscore card from a sales perspective. My sales revenue is on there and we watchit weakly and if it's, if it's off, we have a weekly goal. If it's off, we tryto do something to fix it, and I think that's a big mentality change fromwhere we used to be where it used to kind of be yeah, we're tracking thisand we're looking at it at the end of the quarter. You look and say: Well,you know we needed three million dollars in revenue to hit our annualgoal. We only made two. What should we do now? Whereas now it's you know, wegot ta hit two hundred and seventy twok this week in order to hit our annualbill. We hit a hundred an sixtk last week. What's what's up? Let's Fick,let's talk, let's talk it through the sales team. Do something go you know,that's always kind of changing. Is that is it? Are we making enough calls are?Are we doing anything wrong? Was it a slow week? Was it a holiday was was joeSIC etce, but the data component from watching your business weekly reallychanges. What you do you got. You got stor have to understand that in the USsystem that everybody has KP, that operation team af KPI, that admenpeople have kpeon and everybody is accountable for that and those willchange. I mean we've taken things off our score cards and added new ONS,because what you want up there are whate are the things that you need toknow to make impact with the business. What has a good impact and bad impact?It's not always issues so because one of the key compluters a celebrate thewinds, I mean you really have to have the bitallian excitement about it. Sothis is thiruct organization and looks just right on stuff that you used tolook back at Andso kind of say. Well, we probably should have done somethingor maybe next time we'll do this, but it's in your face, everyevery Fridayafternoon or every Tuesday morning. Whatever your meeting time is and andit's there it's great it's perfect and it's tough is tough and it's hard. You know it gets tough when you missyour score cards there to drive your business for and it gets tough.Sometimes when you miss it or miss it. Multiple weeks, CIN A row and you'retrying to fix it, but just to end on that data component, jol will like thisa little father, son dynamic. I think its either in the traction book or in ablock post. But it's the leadership...
...score card is, is your if your CEOwho's sitting below me on this screen is sitting ot a beach drinking Pini,colata somewhere and a bottle washes up on the shore with just your score cardon it. He should be able to look at that. Look at those eight or ninemetrics and understand how his business is doing without talking to anyonewithout picking up the phone. Without anything, he should be able to look ateight metrics o. We can say my business is doing good, I'm gonna keep drinkingor my business is doing bad, I'm going to hop on the next jet home and try tofix something yeah. I think that's a really good way to look at it. I lovethe it just gives you a pulse at all moments. Are you going in the rightdirection? It's different types of numbers than what you look at in yourPNL Monthlyer at the end of the corner, they're like more leading indicators ofother problems that we need to fix things that we need to address beforethey ecome a major problem: rightht good yeah, exactly, instead of insteadof looking back and trying to fix things that Wern't wrong if it hopallythey are indicated good. Let's move on to the next piece of the PIE, that'sthat! So that's that's my piece, I think so. I'm GOIN TA clearly steal theVision on because Mi role in the EOS program is from what I'm responsible tothe organization. From my point of view, from a day to day, point of view issignificantly less than when we adopted this. It significantly less. Does meless important? I hope maybe it it is, but I hope it's not, but it's well, I'mresponsible for operationand. That's very oll! That's nothing! My Job Wis tobe the visionary, and that means I really we get back to people. Everybodyhas a numberors and I'm supposed to think of ten things that can have animpact to the organization. My role is to maintain the culture of theorganization and drive that and my role is to really help be responsible formajor impact relationships. What resources o the organation need to dothat, or can I help personally? So it's really you create this vision about whoyou are and what you are and what are your core values and what are your corefocus and what's the three uniques about your business, and you make sureyou drive that through the organization and everybody's Shairs, the same thingand the tough part when you adopt the OS, as you find that in every companyhas it, you find people in Tyo organization that don't meet your corevalues. But you say you know, but he's been here a long time and he's reallygood to take care of? U Such and such and you'r the kind of making excuses.But you run the business based on your vision and your score card and yourcore values and those problems weed themselves out because those peopledon't fit anymore and New People are gathered around the same deal. So I'mnot trying to talk like it's a Sosorti or Weiti process, but it's just coolthat three years later that how many people are totally on board and havethe same vision, and so it's really about sharing this. There are eightdirectivs, it says in there and it's about really ties back to the pizzawheel and stuff like that, but it's ware about getting everybody on boardand sharing the open and Onos communication, which is one of the realtenants that I think the es makes it work and it's tough for organization istough for, like Sol proprietors or really tight entremenarous. It reallyhelps a lot of feel share. Company Data Throughout Tho orginsdiction go prettyfar. We don't share Pan Fol Panol, but we share about everything else:throughoutthe organization, so everybody's on board, N and that'smakes it ha shared vision. Yeah. I Thi K shared by all to try onto that bulletpoint of vision and th. Joel basically just talked about it, but the biggestpart of that is the VTO thnk call it, which is your vision, tractionorganizer and all it is, is a two page document that I just pull it up now,because everybody in our company has access to it and we just created a newone. So I don't, I usually have it printed on my wall right here, I'malways staring at it and everybody's always staring at it, and that's areally good thing, because all it is is first page is your vision.It's your core values which everybody in our shop. If you walked up to them,can list off. I like to snap just like that. You know it. Our core focus ourpurpose. In our reason for being here in this world, we create solutionsusing onsite innovations. Again, everybody could list that off our cortetarget our marketing strategy, and then it goes into our three year picture.Where do we want to be revenue wise in two thousand and twenty three? And whatdoes it look like? How are we going to get there and we might not do a? Wehave fifteen things on this list that we think we need to do in the nextthree years to be this size company in three years and wemight do half of those. But these are these. Are Goals were trying to set andachieve to get there and the next pageis is getting digging down deeper?It's just your traction page, your the...
...t of the VTO. What's your what's ourone year plan and what are our seven goals for the year that we're going totake on to get there and those are sales goals, operational goals,administration goals and then your three months, plaing in Q, on how arewe going to get there? How are we going to succeed in Q, one to get to our yearyearly go so these aren't this, isn't a leadership document, that's encompassedbetween jol and myself as the sales and marketing leader in our operationsmanager. This kits launched to everybody and it's public and everybodycan look at it at any point in time and say you know what does it look like?Well, we need six train metrology, operators which maybe nothing to youjoe, but maybe someone's looking at that andsays hey. I just met this guy on site, he's metrologist and he's looking for ajob atd all a sudden. Now we have an additional one, because someone knowsthat in three years were Tarte and torters. Looking for someone like that,instead of just keeping all this information in a tight leadership team,that's public to everybody, yeah, it's great great summer, you guys and thattool will link to it in the show notes. You can find online of me y cou, justgoogle search vision, traction organizer or Vto and then you'll be allfind it all over the place. But it's a really great too. It's like a two pagebusiness plan. I think, is out Gino Wickman, the author of traction,described it and that' a couple things. I really love before we go to the nextpiece of the Pie. You know it's takes that that tenyear vision, where you'rekind of dreaming a little bit you're saying this- is where we want thiscompany to be in ten years, or you know whether it's ten or twenty or whatever,but ten your target, and then you break it all down. It's like okay in the inthe next three years now you start o get a little more specific and you putyou put real revenue and profitability numbers to it like. Where do we want tobe in three years and then it starts to get really tangible. You know, what'swhat are we doing this year? What are we do ing this quarter? What and so,because it's, I think, it's easy to say this is where we want to be in ten orthree years and everybody's like okay, great, let's do it, but this reallybreaks down how youare going to get there every single step of the way itcreates accountability for it. So big fan of that tool, absolutely and yourvision can change you staed here you just stay Ed. Your ten year picture. Isthis big vision and I think any organization or anybody listening-should know that that might change a year from now and it has, it haschanged for us. We had sort of big dreams of this, adding a bunch ofpeople and creating a bunch of revenue and a year into that plan, sort ofrealized. We were we're, really happy being sort of a midsized business thatmakes good money and makes customers happy and sort of shifted our long termplan. It was a complete Pibot, basically in the best sense of the work,so it was really good and the traction set up allowed us to do that prettyquickly and very, very they Shuso we've talked about data and we've talkedabout vision. The first you know to two of the six pieces. Where should we gonext? APAL PEOPLE? Let's do it? El Pizza, PI, number, three people writepeople, write, seats, track or DOS or track. I alwayst call traction insod E,Eus, fo or whatever reason I like, Inter to I'm a tired guy attractes. The bookjust for clarity for the LISTENERSS is the book that sort of takes. Youthrough the whole process of the entrepreneural atoperating system orEOS, so yeah, likeme and you're very bad at reading books, I'm not trying toplug the book, but there's another book called what the Heck is: Eos Nit, it'smuch shorter. So, yes, it is yeah, not a huge fan of reading. You can dothat. Our whole agency is currently reading. That right now is as we speak,because after our leadership team has read it so yeah the people componentwrite people, write, seats and Jole kind of mentioned in the Vision Section,but another slogan that's used. A lot is higher and fire around your corevalues and make sure that you have the right people doing the right job andthat the seats associate in with your organization structure is built to dowhat you wanted to do. So the really big aspect for us is creating thataccountability, chart, which I think I joked with you, joe on a previousconversation as simple as having an org charter, an accountability chart asthey call it is, I'm not sure we actually Hav. We did have one before wewent down this path, but it was updated, maybe every other year, because somecustomer asked for it. You know: Hey show us your Oran chart, because weneed it for to certify you in our system or whatever is like oh shootlike who still works. HHERE we got ta, we got ta update it now, so having theaccountability chart and truly seeing...
...how you know your departments flow andwhat people are actually responsible for their responsibilities in thoseseats is a huge aspect, making sure that the seat actually does what it'ssupposed to do and not just have some floating, Oh D. I need to hire anothersales guy just because or I need a marketing person, because I think so hi's something that I thinkreally add some definition to it and I illi will readily admit that this isprobably the most difficult section for me in our EOS traction journey. Ididn't think we could do it. I woas and I didn't have to do it because I had towrite and I have one person I one person Oto reports to me- and I am mein my department, so ias really easy for me, but it was so donting to saythat we're going to have an accountability structure, ing a writtendescription for every person. The organization is, and it's not it oo,compasses something about their job responsibilities, but it's a lot morethan that. It's their commitment to orization and and Mikelik said now. Wemake every decision when something goes sideways. He said: Let's talk about thecore values which which of the corvins? Are They not holding up? Why did thatcause a problem and it does and we're o the point now that we pick our vendorsbased on core values if they don't adhere to our core value set, and it'sgoing to be a problem, we know it and W we fired customers. You know Wewe come close to t realrecently with biggest project. We have goingto it. You know like we wereuncomfortable with the safety commitment but pases on our core values.We just call a meeting and everybody got in that meeting from both sides andwe expressed our concerns and totally appreciate it, and I don't think we'dhave done that prior to because I don't know it just changes our wholecommitment to each other, and so- and this is the right people rigt seat as abig Jim collinsdeal in his books, and it's so Valit when, especially when youhave the the acount of billy, all structured, it's just it's cool, verydifferent yeah. I agree. I love the right people right, seats, thing andthinking about as you create that accountability chart not who is hereright now at the organization and how we're going to find a role that makessense for them. But instead thinking about where what structure do we needfor this organization to achieve what we're trying to achieve and do we havethe right people in each of those seats, and I think things you'll find are wellthis person's kind of in the wrong seat. I mean we saw it recently in our agency,where we had had someone move, take a horizonal move and they're now they'reoperating, and you know the dance Al entacts about the unique ability, ifyou guys know familiar with that, but know ther're all kinds of names for it.But there's you know having people operating within their two skill setsand in a place where there they're happy in their creating value for theorganization. I think it'll help you find those things. It also help. Youidentify I've seen a few already having just gotten started with the Ostr, ourcompany, where we know there are seats that we don't have a person at thiscompany right now in this seat that we kind of need, and so it helps us make adecision about. You know some hires that are going to have to be on thehorizon here so yeah. I think it's Cool N and you don't make sort of halfaskcommitments either don say well, let's his put. Let's put this person in thisjob because it's better than nothing or whatever yeah now not going to do that.If they don't hit the mark, then we're just we're, not Gongno do, and it'sjust like you said Jo, I mean the key ingredient. Is You get people in theredoing things that they like to do and things the more you can drive h intothe quadra things thatare good at and things they like to do and that sameline with it. The organization needs man then thet. Just then you get theanother Jym Collins term with one of my favorites N, then you get the fly wheelrolling so once you get it moving, then you keep it moving and and things takecare of themselves, but it's really cool a huge aspect of it to andsomething that I struggle with that. My Il give a shout out to our implementorJoe Palson has helped me with his elevating and delegating and makingshare people do their job. He right people hey've got the right people onthe right seats. They can make decisions and do a good job. You don'thave to be the puppytear from the top Maridett man getting your hands andeverything, and I struggle with that- and he continues to has continued totell me over the years. There's no dotted lines on your accountability,chart of well this guy or ga reports to me, but kind of reports over here. It'slike no, where does the information, an data goand? WHO MAKES THAT DECISION?There's what there's one line and it goes everything spiders out into youraccountability chart, and we don't. You know we don't have a huge organization,but we have seventy plus people pull and it gets big fast and you got togive people the power to make decisions, and you also I have thirteen people onmy section of the accountability chart and that might sound like a few to sum,but it rowse into a lot of...
...conversations and communications prettyfast when you can delegate that to other people managing and approvingdecisions and making their own decisions, it really helps absolutelywell. We could probably talk about this one all day, but for the sake ofkeeping it going, let's, let's go to whatever is whatever we'reever want togo. Next, we've done data we've done vision, we've done people, we get threemore pieces of the Pie to talk about here. You want to do issues or processnext would take process, because issues is more interesting in that we can savethat one, but the se the process. To me again from the way I operate. The Way Iam which is if a shiny thing goes by, I'm going to chase it and alwaysdreaming and know, there's something else going on and here's another bigopportunity- and I like this guy he's going to be my friend: Let's hire himand you know that so it's complete kind of opposite of me, but the process islike the accountability. It was totally dawning to me that we thought that wecould document. Even though, for the last five years I've been preachingprocess over personality and stuff, like that, you know: let's, let's but'get the folk lor out of it. Let's get the history and stuff like that thateverybody knows get trying to weed that out and stuff like that. So then youjust start documenting everything you do and you don't it's not telling youto pick up this pin and write it this way and it's not a big picture on theprocess of WHO's responsible for it and how does it flow men we're below that?You can ave worksteps and you know and work rules and stuff like that, but thegeneral process, and then you get the people just then it ties right back tothe people that by in and then you get to elevate and delegate you and letthose people do Tho Jumb rerequire to do a job and so that you keep doing thehines value work that you can do that you can bring the organization you stayup at the we talk about Joe Pawson's big on Yo talk about an accounting,firm or allegal firm. You start making the five hundred dollar an hourdecisions and let other people make the lower decision. So you need to stay uphigh and do your job and let the other people do the other things and quitjumping on everything and taking care of it. So processes help you do it andyou tie that back to the accountability and Corvalus, and it's easy so and itmakes a dramatic difference and it will come up exactly. One of the reason Iwante to do this before issues is because that's the fundamental problemwith all issues in organization with ninety push percenteg issues inorganzation. When we get to that point I'll explain it then sure he took myteaser trailer for moving in from process to issues, because I completelyagree. The process component for us has been immensely helpful because you justwrite down you're, basically, writing down how you perform for your self andyour customers successfully. It's the simple steps, not the not the anigrityof this is what has to be done in order to be successful, and it's very easy topoint to, and somebody doesn't follow it and either retrain or regroup orEthink, or very easy to point to. When things aren't working, you can tell youcan, when things aren't working, you can ask yourself well. Are we followingthe process and should the process be changed, because maybe the processisn't right? WHATAS, my favorite quote from flakes jolls old old sales whorarani friend of ours is your process is perfectly designed to give you theresults that you're getting and if your results suck, then your processprobably sucks exactly right. Flakes is Brian Flannigin. Look him up piece e,giving a full credit here, not just flakes Brintan Playingan, greatmotivator sales, trainer beautiful, which leads to issues yep number fiveissues have added insues. If I could make the pizza pie analogy again, thisis like your deep dish, Chicago style pizza guys were getting too close tolunch. Lunch here. To Talk About Pizza, I'm I think I know I'm Gona be havingfor lunch now so anyway, continue I'm after the new Detroit now pizza is thatright, ohavto talk about that one. After the fact issues are the biggestissue on this pizza pot chart, because somebody else will tell you, but I'lltell you right now that every company has a lot of issues, whether Youareusing eos, ortraction or another tool or INA or just running a business. Youhave issues every week. I will probably say that so pels it has this hugecomponent of bringing those to the surface and talking about them andidsing them t a you, create a list of issues and you Idsit, that's a termthat we use day and d day out now, because of traction and IDs stands foridentify identify what the actual issue is discuss, discuss it lay out thefacts, not opinions, but facts of the...
...issue and solve the SSIS for solvesolve it. What is t what is the root cause? What cause this issue? What issomething we can do to solve it right now or in a more simple term. What issomething we can try to do to make it better and see if it solves it, andmaybe it goes away next week and we never hear about it again or maybe itcomes back and we idsit again and figure out if we can solve a differentway. This is idsis the most powerful tool that there is in the whole system.In my view, and it's the hardest one to do well, because everybody's preupposedto do things, you bring you shoes, you bring problems to your meeting, thenyou already know the answer to, but you don't that's not the way it works. Theworks. Is You right now? What's the pain point just Lik Gouk said, then youput the discussion up there and you go through everything that what are thefacts just throw them out there. Then you pick the one is the most relevantto be the root cost and when you do it like that, it works really powerfulland it's hard. You fall back because everybody comes in with you know.That's Quay Billy Don you whatever it is. You predisposed and everybody'slike that. So this is something that you grow and get better. I mean this isa tool that you just get better and better at and you find yourself allingback, but I guarantee you just like. We said that and you go back to if you'vegot your processes and you've got the right people. Then the issue t thatwhen you get down to the rout cause man, man, man, the vast majority of the time-it's like you know what you know hy that happened like that, because wedidn't have a good process for we. I not define the process ahead of time orthat person was not fully informed of that process. So it's say that or theother side is. Why did that happen? Because we didn't follow the process?You may have it, but you don't follow it. So it's is really simple, you knowand that you spend more time listening them out and then you by consense itsone of the few things that you really have to do by consensus, whoever's inyour meeting to make that decision, Ato, whatever group or whatever, has come in,but we solve problems like this face to face now so aluke and I have somethingto wear button heads about or something that's bothering us about the orenation.We just you just keep driving and talking about til you get the rootcause and everything else is nonsense. Yous you worry about that later or okay,I've SI've ve, taken it as far as I can as there anything else, we need to do.No okay, then then Ey implement something to do turned into it. To doyou know we hannreally talked about that which is coming up. This is awe're really good at Seguin this yeah, you really are it's very natural to goright into compo anything else. To add to the issues before go to traction- orI just got some of that, because it's kind of where I was leaning into but before before I setuayd into JoelStill Buti would just say that issues are thehuge Chicago, deep dish pizza for me because, like I said everybody has some,every company has em every person working in a company Hasm. We talkabout them weekly and I will still say that we probably bury thirty percent ofour issues, because at the end of the year you go to the big annual meetingand Someonesas God. pisses me off and Joe Doe this every week and it's likeand that's like. That's just hurting our businesses well w. Why didn't youbring that up in January rather than you know? Now it's it's December now.It's just frustrates me, TAT's, a there's, there's still those underlyingthings at our organization, but the fact that we bring up seventy percentof them now and talk about it. I think is a great thing and I don't think Idon't think anybody's ever going to be a hundred percent perfect, becausethings take you off or pissy off or just aren't big enough of a problem tojust deal with when they probably should be dealt with anyways just kindof comparing it to bi compared to anything it's if anybody listening ispodcast is married. You know you have your, you have your issues with yourspouse or your family and the big ones you you talk through and some of theother ones you just kind of, let boil over and get upset about, but the Ithink the successful marriages and relationships talk about importantissues that bother them and try to fix them, and the same could be said forcompanies out there yeah. I think, that's, I think. That's that's! Itmight not hurt you now, but you GIN TA crash and burn a year from now or threeyears from now, because you didn't solve something or just let it slide orsomeone's going to leave your company that you didn't want to leave orsomeone's going to competitors going to take something from because you're notaddressing something you k. o, I mean that's, that's something tha I wouldgive ourselves a big pon on the back and Luke's been a big driver and Itso.We have a system that flags issues I mean. If something goes wrong, it getsnoted and it's it has to be presented to whatever group, whether it'soperations admen sales, it havs to go to that group and it has to come backto handle someway or affection, and- and you want to do that, but man don'tget the don't get the impression that this thing is strict. CETEOL setsbecause it's designed for entrepreneur-...
...and this is a deal gonow Wikman justsaw that like successful companies, the real successful companies had certainthings in common that they handled in a certain way. And so that's what thesethings are all about: they're, really guys, because you don't want to losethat that challenge spirit that go, try something new spirit and stuff likethat, because you know some of your processes might be sump as like turnthe guy loose with a box of Crans and would make him draw a picture. YouKdon't tell him what to Dra just give them give hem the freedom that might beyour process. You know, I think a one very important factor for anybodylistening is that issues is not a negative word. Ois, not a bad thing atall, and sometimes issues are informational or positive things. Youknow I got an issue. I got my box of crayons out and Iinvented this new thing. I like what do you guys think yeah, let's talk aboutit and maybe throw it into the system, so isus going to be opportunities asmuch as theire problems in your organizition issues can easily soundlike a negative word, but it should never be construed as tattling onsomeone or telling or pulling in an issue because something bothers youshould be addressed rather than just hoping that it goes away. We still Imean we're three and a half years into it or something like that and we'restill have to de like wel. I didn't want to raise that. I just took care ofit, it's easier for me to just handle it stuff, like Thas, like man, thatjust that just wreks everything don't do that anymore. So we go to attraction,which is the Tiin right from issues and the deal about issues is well theyre.They talk about. It says, rocks on this little pine that I'm looking at rocksand meetings and H. Those are two components, so you have scheduledmeetings on a scheduled time frame generally weekly the leadership teammeets once a week. You mean at the same time for the same duration with thesame set ofgenda, and then you that's the way everybody an orgazation shouldgenerally meet our operations. Team meets a specific day every week at ofspecific time with the same agenda. The francadme and that's where you sortYoan it can't go over and being on time, is everything if you're late. You arecheating everybody else in the organization, certainly in that meening,so it gets stricten and it becomes something that I was a real antimeating guy, but o really look forward to it. It's good. So you have mespecific time and you deal with the things and you deal with your scorecard. Every meeting and everybody's got the KPI that they're looking at to workwith the data and issues or things are what's you're, taking care of and rocksor big things that you have to do. That's major import items to your group,your section, your organization that and those you can't get that done in aweek right. So that's a ninety day process. Sometime in next nine days,I'm gonna do this with orization. If I'm going to build a new such and suchI'm going to have a prodoctype, I'm going to write a a procedure for thisor something like that, something Tas opcomsomentand, I'm going to produce apodcast yeah, exactly exactly so, and then whatever is smaller than that,which is how you handle most of the IDs when you have the solve equation are todos, and so you just delegate to dos okay, Joe, we found out that you knowyou're, not flipping your likes off every night. So I need you to commit toFu turn your legs off every day or get susie delegate. It get susy to turnyour lights off and you leave every night doesn't matter so todos are justthe action items it's to and the next week those Todos are they're, not justhand it out. Saying Luk, you go. Do this joe you this Jodo than TheyreWittin down and the next week when you come to the meeting you're like well Lu.Did you turn your lights out every day? No, I didn't do that. No, I did Orr, you say done and if youdidn't get it none you usually get one got out of jail card free and it's likeokay, you got another week, can you get it done in the next week? Yeah Acain,okay, I'll, do it. You commit it, so it just a levor commitment- and this iswhen you got this. Is I like to talk about it in the book and our integratedour implementor talks about traction. This is the park. That's on the road.This is t e part where hat gets the fly wil going. This is the moment Om. Thisis the quote: Traction that make sure business really rock and rolled. So this I this is. This is where you tieit all together and it's fun. It's a good deal. This is when you really makethings happen. You know we Garilla we four or five years ago we hired anoutside consultant who did a great job for us and brought elements of the USprocess into things we were doing, but we committed back round the beginningof Q, four that to last year to to doing traction. Pure and we sort ofkicked it off in December and so we're just kind of up and running with it now,but what I really love about these, what's called the L ten meeting, whichis what we're describing right now like...
...for us. It's eight thirty am ten, amevery single Tuesday morning and the some of the pushback I had, and mybusiness partner had on this whole traction process like four years ago,and we were thinking about doing- is it's like it's too many meetings toomuch time spent meeting, but what I have learned already from we'veliterally done three or four of these lten meetings this year. We areaccomplishing so much in these meetings and so much time is actually beingsaved because we're all on the same page talking through this stuff. Youknow, majority of that. Ninety minute meeting is spent on the IDs ing likegoing through that issue's list and you prioritize of the most important issues,and then you go through that IDs process. We identify them, you discussthem and you solve them and you walk out of there with solutions all thosethings. The things can't that can't get solved you assign it to do for somebodyto work on it offline, and so I think it's one of the biggest probablyhurdles people are going to have when they look at this process. E're goingto say it's too much meeting, we don't have time to do all these meetings. Youwill save time. I can I've been doing this for a month only, and I canpromise you already that that's going to be the case. There's a slightcontrotary fail that it from our experiences S. I assume it happenselsewhere as that you can do meetings, create meetingsand you try and seek consensus, because that's the way your alten metisgenerally operate on sort of an attitude of consensus that you startseeking consensus for too many things sometimes remember that elevatondelegating o remember the spirit that got you to what you were, which is youknow, you're out there swatchbuckin and women. So you can tie yourself up alittle bit if you're, not careful and stuff like Thot, but the way out ofthat trap is we'd, raise it in an L, ten meeting and say I've got too manymeetings and then you would sort it down and say: Leting you're, notdelegating so that's kind of solved itself, but it's a custionary tale toyeah. I completely agree with you Joe. I have. I already have too manymeetings, but my sales alten and my leader, I've been to I'm in two L tens,because I had o lead my sales team and I'm in I'm on the leadership team. Sothat's three hours in my week right there and sort of a little bit of kindof thinking and planning before and after but like you said, sapaid goes alot Ong way to saving Yeu time or the other thirty seven hours of the week orhowever many hours I work. I think it's also kind of interesting that point outwhy they're called all tims. Yes, I joe kind of Seguaie into that on the factthat you're getting value out of the meeting. I pulled up our agenda here. Iguess I'll start with the end. At the end of every meeting, you conclude andyou go over your toduce and you say got it and that sounds really weird, but itworks because people have, if I say jode, I need you to turn your lightsoff this week. GOT IT JOE says: got it got it so, but now everybody everybodyon our meeting- knows that Joe committed to doing that. So that soundskind of Corny and cheesy. But it goes a long way to people saying I'm going todo this this week and you guys are going to hold me accountable and nextweek when that person shows up and hasn't done it, you kind of get theevilized stare and you know they're going to get it done the next week. Sothere's a lot of account of be there, but the conclusion you a you, gothrough your Tados and you end with rating the meeting one toten and that'son how the meeting was run. The value you got out of the meeting and yourgoal is to have a meeting tattis a ten out of ten everytime. If you have a ten, you just say ten. If you have anywhere between onethrough nine, you give a little chip at t. What can we do to make the meetingbetter? I give this meeting at Ait, because I showed up late to this thispodcast meeting. If I did again, I would show up on time so that I wasmore conscious to Joe and Joles time. You got your one get out of jail, freepass right, so ye use thatbut the agenda to at Lten Tetol Sad. He talkedabout rocks. Those are quarterly goals that each individual is accountable forbith the agenda s you check in give a personal and a professional best takesfive minutes to run through all thirteen of the people, Onli sales team-and I can't tell you how powerful that is, that sounds simple and cheesy, butANC' your personal best from last week and what your professional best fromlast week and I talked to most of my team throughout the week, but it reallygives me a chance to learn about them as people. You know I I my daughter,learned to play guitar. You know my daughter took her first step or I got acheese burger. You Know Tay, I personal best range from you know. I wenthunting or I did this all right sat around and watch TV all weekend, andthat was just great. So it's it truly is a great way to continue to get apersonal insight into your employees and people you manage. I think it'sabsolutely a way to build. The whole...
...system purposely builds Comroderan,closeness and OPENTHISS in your organization. It's ep: It does becauseyou you're naked in those meeting. Sometimes man, you just you've, mademistakes and you have to own up Tohim to your Cohorte, your partners and youmake commitments and like Luke says I mean you started that meeting sayinglike you know, I had the most wonderful weekend doing such and such it's apersonal deal. So I think it's. This whole system creates just an ASPRETA,corn and openess and attitude n organization. If you do it right, it'sfantastic. It's really helpful because I'm bad summarizing I'll just runthrough the agenda. There's the Checkin. Let's just talked about, then you goover your score, cart, anythings, off track! YOU PUT ON THE ISSUES LIST! TSO!You can discuss it later in the meeting. You do your rock review, which iseverybody's quarterly goals. You can talk through them and you ask ifthey're, ontrack or off track if they're off track put them on theissues list. Don't talk about Hem now and why you just say: Omtracktor offtrack, go through your Tados all thed to do. Is this assign last week ask ifthey were done if they're done they're done? If they're not, I don't know ifthis is actually ws, but we give a one week get out of jail free car, but youknow. Is it an issue? If it's not done put on the issues list, you go throughyour headlines, people headlines theres what they call it. I in mind meetingcallit the good, the bad and the ugly, because I'm a big clenny slip fan andjust you know, good news. Bad News from last week are really ugly news thatneeds to hit the issues list from from every person out in the meeting, notjust the leader and then you get to the bulk of the meeting. Thirty minutes onmy sales meeting is IDs, so all of these issues talked about that peoplemight now. You know people come not wanting to bring issues they bubble upin these headlines and squore card and segue section and end up on your issueslist, and he might have three and spend thirty minutes selve and three or tenminutes. Oen Three might have fifteen and spend thirty minutes solving theseven most important ones, because you might not get to Hem all and Yot justhen. The time runs out. The time runs out and you conclude your meeting andif those issues are important next week you salv them. Then, because you spentyou spent the thirty minutes. Fighting the fires that you need to solve andthe other ones either aren't important enough to solve right now or the nextweek. He bring them back up and someone's like that's, not really anissue anymore and you're like all right, Proim Solf, it went away, it's really cool. It really keeps youfocused on doing what's the most important and stuff like that, so youcan have twenty things, but you've got three rocks thatar right in your faceand six Todos or whatever. That's all you get to work about you, you can'tget distracted with the other stuff and say I didn't get to that, becauseyou've already told the world that those are your priorities, so it makes the product. Tuity is prettysubstantial when you get it working right, that's great, O! Guys I want toput a rap on this episode in a couple minutes here, but can you finish byjust telling me what impact, if you had to boil it down to you, know few thingswhat impact has doing this process? You know running the US inside of YourBusiness for a few years now had on your organization ahead, Loke, becauseyou're going to claim my stol you stuff. If I go first, I think tels is traction, has truly LShas created traction in our organization, Thatsi'll be the cheesyone that says that, but we are driving so much more momentum thanwe would have had, because we have all the pieces of the pile we justdiscussed, which some are very simple and some aren't as as simple as theyseem when you start to do them we're driving revenue growth as the salesmanager. That's the easiest one to point how we've grown revenues Touusing tration. I think it's brought us closer together as an organization andjust have people that understand what we want to do and Wheteve'r going andcare about the business and where Maktic Geaner with pride, because theylike working for this organization. I think it's allowed us to truly createcore values and share those with our employees and have people that want towork here and want to be a part of. I mean I tend to call this a team ratherthan a business or group of employees and it's people that want to be part ofthe MAKTIC team, and I think they've created that environment with thissystem and its paydividends for us, with keeping people retaining peoplefinding new people that want to help Ghrow this business and have success intheir own paycheck and account because of that big gots thoare great, and Iwould agree with Lok, especially I think I it's driven mactick branddramatically overthe last couple o years throughout our organization andwe're spelling it to the rest of the world as well. I just have to say thatit also it makes you really understand both the people involved in yourorganization and what they do in in the sexualae. So you come to reallyunderstand what your strengths and weaknesses and how powerful it is. Soin that case Waf you're good at it, then you focus that you know you findthe market opportunities but tie into...
...where your strengths that have theright margins or whatever, and you can drive that direction rather than youknow. I used to run this business which, like I just told people what do we dosay? Well, we do stuff for money, you know F, Somebodyhas got some moneywe'll do it for him kind of doing that doesn't work when you get a certainsize and stuff. So I think it's about focus. I think it's about community. Ithink that's a word that I like a lot. I think I could cals it a team. I thinkwe have a real community- and I think that includes our customers to you know,and our vendors and stuff like that and we reach out and it's just honest andopen and that's the that's the real horse power. I mean there's a lot ofrules and sets and guidelines and stuff like that. But you know you geteverybody pulling the same direction. Then you get a lot. You get a lot ofgood stuff happening. Open and honest is a big Er. Is that a is that a younow lat's termer a Joe Palson term? I don't know, but it's one that we livean by and it's one that I can't tell everybody enough time, Oti about aspowerful as it gets being open and honest with your employees and yourbusiness. I'm looking I'm looking at our Italiano Pizza Pie here and yourdata you're, open, you're, sharing your data with your employees and yourselveson keeping your score C card. Your process you're open and honest abouthow you do things issues, obviously open and honest with the issues thatare bugging you or holding you back or keeping you from being successful. Yourpeople you're open and honest about hiring and firing and having the rightpeople in the right seats and your vision. Eight questions shared by allthe vto E, talked about your open and honest you're, telling everybody inyour organization where you're going to go and how you going to get there allthat creates trumral TRACRAC action exactly right. That's that's! A greatdescription. Grou should get like five cents every time I say it on thispodcast or swor, everybody take a shot. Yeah like it could work work out a dealwith EOLS worldwide. You know see ier to me if they yeah, I'm sure that'lcome up with widly broadcast is your blog is well guys. This is awesome, greatconversation to really appreciate you doing this. I was hoping you could tellour audience the best way to get in touch with you and where they can learnmore about macteck marketing. Guy S, l back tat on sidecom mactock on Sitecom,right and mactech is pelled Mac tech correctohnsite. The list that the shownotes as well s. You can click through and see what these guys are doing,really impressive. The way you guys are running your organization, I thinkthat's probably a apparent to everybody. After having listened to this episode,so congrats on what you've been able to Accompanit, I mean more so than getting business t weenjoy talking to other businesses and people that do things differently, oryou know, working together with Secon. What about like partner businesses thatjust are entreredeal or looking for growth in nature or something we alwaysenjoy doing, and even I think, I'm a big proponent, and I joe know you youare because you have this podcast of just people, learning from each otherand finding fun thing way: s the ad growth and business and, having alittle bit of fun Li, you Whil, you Werk Conto Your Day, Job Yeah! I agree.That's trotally! The one. If I have a closing piece of advice is if you'regoing to consider Aneus, you read the book or read the what the heck of te Ostalk to people hove Don, but if you're going to do it, man go on and get inthe get in the water. Don't think you can kind of Wade into it and do alittle bit of time. We did that and we learned how to do some meeting stuff,but you really want. If you really want the impact, it's painful and it's longit takes a while to get there at sometimes but man jumpin that pond.It's a good good advice- and I degree from my experience so far so joe wittenbreaker Luke Witton Breaker, look hem up on Linkin, look at Mac tech onSitecom to see what they're doing and guys thanks for doing this today reallyappreciate it. Absolutely. Thank you. Thank you very muco awesome. You Bet.As for the rest of you, I hope to catch you on the next episode of theManufacturing Executive. You've been listening to themanufacturing executive podcast to ensure that you never missed an episode.Subscribe to the show in your favorite podcast player, if you'd like to learnmore about industrial marketing and sale strategy, you'll find an everexpanding collection of articles, videos guides and tools, specificallyfor B to B manufacturers at grilla. Seventy SIXCOM flashwar. Thank you somuch for listening until next time.
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